All please rise, I speak:
I look in disgust when I see children denied from a great part of knoledge and fiction. "It is too violent" or "it deals with human reproduction" are common excuses for the prohibition. Luckily the means of control are too weak and people learn about these adult things:
Imagine if in near future the computer empowered control would truly succeed in this attempt of control. The new age children growing up would eventually (for example in age of 16, 18 or 21) learn about the real world. Having a strongly distorted view of the world their behavior would be very unpredictable.
And even with our less perfect method of denying material from children we have gone already too far. USA with their no sex-education at all is a most damning example. It is a naive idea that something would disappear if we did not see it and talk about it. (Nobody talks about daddy''s drinking and it will go away. Ok?)
I was encouraged to play violent games, shoot with my family''s firearms and do all these cool things when I was a child. When I went to school I was told that violence is an acceptable method of protection, but it is dishonorable to be violent for any other cause. I studied later Judo and Karate and learned about their philosophy and it did not change much my earlier attitude towards violence. I think that children should learn about good violence: protecting themselves and the ones they care for.
In many video games there is of course an evil approach to the use of violence, but seeing that this is evil it will not corrupt the player, but this is a matter of parents to tell the children.
... and this idea "little kids become de-sensitized to the violence"... I think that it is better to become de-sensitized than be unaware or shocked by violence... Because people de-sensitized will still now the right and wrong, but people who are unaware or shocked are just easy targets for robberies and bullying.
-Osmo Suvisaari
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Games cannot cause violence, but what if....
Nice debate you have here. My Opinion is that in a way all of you are right.
You see people are different.... very different. You can have a 14 (or less) year old kid that plays violent games and watches violent movies yet knows what is right and what wrong so those games and movies don''t make an impression on him and he uses them only to do and see things that he can''t do or see in real life.
On the other side you can have an 35 year old "adult" that isn''t able to recognise right from wrong. The fact thast he got that far can only be tributed to his ability to hide those tendencies or to the fact that people don''t take the time to get to know him and find out his tendencies and deal with him. People like these are tempted to do things the see on TV/Games .... in fact they are VERY tempted and soner or later they will try things and "normal people" would not.
The fact that some people can be so unstable and can''t differ from right and wrong can be tributed to many things but the main couse is their brain. They can either have an unstable brain (mentaly unsable) to a degree that they will never understand what is right. They can only be easily influenced and in that case parents and teachers have thre job of teaching those people what is right and what is wrong before they get the wrong impressions that can ruin theirs and other peoples lives.
These border cases are really the problem in the world. It''s hard to recognize these tendencies and if they are not recognized fast enough and the handling is not proper a person like that will soner or later try to express those trendencies in real life. Movies and Games can provide them with ideas but it''s not the fault of these sources of enertainment since if they wouldn''t find something they like there they would find it in news or even in real life.
Unstable people that are tought to contain their violent thoughts can also be very valuable to the society. They think different... they can look on things from different perspectives so they can be very valuable in research. Since they are so different they get hated or avoided from "normal people". We all know that if somebody is hated for no other reason than for being diffeernt you can get hmmmm... well angry. That state in an unstable mind can get VERY dangerous.
To summarize all of this:
People that think differently help the world evolve yet they can also destroy it. "Normal people" should help them to stay within the confines of certain rules and try not to destroy their lives with making them feel unwanted as that can push already unstable people over the edge.
thanks for listening
Tekumze
"The reason people blame things on the previous generations is that there''s only one other choice."
You see people are different.... very different. You can have a 14 (or less) year old kid that plays violent games and watches violent movies yet knows what is right and what wrong so those games and movies don''t make an impression on him and he uses them only to do and see things that he can''t do or see in real life.
On the other side you can have an 35 year old "adult" that isn''t able to recognise right from wrong. The fact thast he got that far can only be tributed to his ability to hide those tendencies or to the fact that people don''t take the time to get to know him and find out his tendencies and deal with him. People like these are tempted to do things the see on TV/Games .... in fact they are VERY tempted and soner or later they will try things and "normal people" would not.
The fact that some people can be so unstable and can''t differ from right and wrong can be tributed to many things but the main couse is their brain. They can either have an unstable brain (mentaly unsable) to a degree that they will never understand what is right. They can only be easily influenced and in that case parents and teachers have thre job of teaching those people what is right and what is wrong before they get the wrong impressions that can ruin theirs and other peoples lives.
These border cases are really the problem in the world. It''s hard to recognize these tendencies and if they are not recognized fast enough and the handling is not proper a person like that will soner or later try to express those trendencies in real life. Movies and Games can provide them with ideas but it''s not the fault of these sources of enertainment since if they wouldn''t find something they like there they would find it in news or even in real life.
Unstable people that are tought to contain their violent thoughts can also be very valuable to the society. They think different... they can look on things from different perspectives so they can be very valuable in research. Since they are so different they get hated or avoided from "normal people". We all know that if somebody is hated for no other reason than for being diffeernt you can get hmmmm... well angry. That state in an unstable mind can get VERY dangerous.
To summarize all of this:
People that think differently help the world evolve yet they can also destroy it. "Normal people" should help them to stay within the confines of certain rules and try not to destroy their lives with making them feel unwanted as that can push already unstable people over the edge.
thanks for listening
Tekumze
"The reason people blame things on the previous generations is that there''s only one other choice."
quote: Original post by Anonymous Poster
It''s everyone''s responsibility to be able to differentiate between fantasy/fiction and the real world. If you can''t handle that, get institutionalized.
$0.02
Well, no. It''s everyone''s responsibility to -teach- others how to do this. Right and wrong are not necessarily innate. Some people are harder to reach than others, but this is society''s problem. If society as a whole believes that it is wrong to kill others, it is society''s job to ensure that this doesn''t happen. To reward pro-social behaviour and discourage anti-social behaviour. And if everyone wants to shirk their own part of the collective responsibility, you hear the developer say "well, it got rated such that they shouldn''t have got the game" and the vendor says "they shouldn''t be able to get fake ID" and the parent says "I can''t watch them 24hrs/day", then it''s pretty obvious that the blame/responsibility is shared. You never know what effect a certain stimuli might have on a person. If you don''t want to accept some small degree of responsibility, you have less place to complain when someone you know is on the receiving end.
I am by nature a very violent person. And I gotta say , violent games dont make me wanna go out and do something , as a matter of fact they allow me to indulge my impulses without getting myself into trouble , They act as some kinda release .(thank God for small favours)
Gentlemen,
I doubt that a virtual massmurder every now and then in Quake or any other game will encurage me to leave my computer (God forbid that!
) and slaughter every person I''ll meet on the street.
However, things always happens, and there is always something/someone to blame. No one are responsible for other peoples actions, unless, someone else pushed them or made them do it. Anyway, I would think that computer games/movies (or films as I rather say)/TV/books/comics and whatever else has at some point caused someone to commit a crime.
Our society needs scapgoats. When films (movies for the US) become available for renting, and the VHS became popular, then that was to blame for the violent youth. Comics has been there, TV is always there, now it''s the computer games turn to be the one to blame.
Just wait and see until VR gets into every man''s home...
Take it easy...
I doubt that a virtual massmurder every now and then in Quake or any other game will encurage me to leave my computer (God forbid that!
) and slaughter every person I''ll meet on the street.However, things always happens, and there is always something/someone to blame. No one are responsible for other peoples actions, unless, someone else pushed them or made them do it. Anyway, I would think that computer games/movies (or films as I rather say)/TV/books/comics and whatever else has at some point caused someone to commit a crime.
Our society needs scapgoats. When films (movies for the US) become available for renting, and the VHS became popular, then that was to blame for the violent youth. Comics has been there, TV is always there, now it''s the computer games turn to be the one to blame.
Just wait and see until VR gets into every man''s home...
Take it easy...
Who says computer games affect kids, imagine if PacMan affected us as kids, we''d all sit around in a darkened room munching pills and listening to repetitive music....uh oh!
Hhmm, flashback, someone posted the same thing as Anonymous somewhere before....
Anyway, violent games do effect kids in the same way the news effects us. We see endless of violence on the news every day and we get numb. We don''t react the same way anymore it''s just another day...children also get numb if they are exposed to violence every day and I''m not just talking about violence in games.
Ok, I''m not against violence in computer games, I''m one of those how enjoy it. However, I encurage age limits on games and parents to make sure that their children do not play games that are not suitable for them. This is not the most easiest thing to do, I know, but if you don''t try you already failed.
/Mr K
Anyway, violent games do effect kids in the same way the news effects us. We see endless of violence on the news every day and we get numb. We don''t react the same way anymore it''s just another day...children also get numb if they are exposed to violence every day and I''m not just talking about violence in games.
Ok, I''m not against violence in computer games, I''m one of those how enjoy it. However, I encurage age limits on games and parents to make sure that their children do not play games that are not suitable for them. This is not the most easiest thing to do, I know, but if you don''t try you already failed.
/Mr K
Bah! twice!
Violence in the media isn''t a recent development.
It wasn''t new in Homer''s day.
It wasn''t new in Shakespeare''s day.
It wasn''t new in Hemmingway''s day.
The only thing that''s changed is that there is now a global network of media that runs 24/7.
So they(the media) can spread panic faster and more effectively than ever before.
The only other thing that''s changed is that with modern medicine and social safety nets, people who would''ve gotten weeded out of the population in times past are surviving longer.
As long as NASCAR and the WWF are allowed to thrive, we have absolutely NOTHING to fear.
$0.02
Violence in the media isn''t a recent development.
It wasn''t new in Homer''s day.
It wasn''t new in Shakespeare''s day.
It wasn''t new in Hemmingway''s day.
The only thing that''s changed is that there is now a global network of media that runs 24/7.
So they(the media) can spread panic faster and more effectively than ever before.
The only other thing that''s changed is that with modern medicine and social safety nets, people who would''ve gotten weeded out of the population in times past are surviving longer.
As long as NASCAR and the WWF are allowed to thrive, we have absolutely NOTHING to fear.
$0.02
Another Anonymous Poster
If a kid killed another kids, then is the kid the only person to be blamed? Even if the kid is the only person to have "legal" responsibility, the kid may not be the only person to be blamed in the ethical viewpoint.
All kids have the human right to be well educated. That means if our game affects kids badly, or if our game weakens their moral, then we are responsible. We violated kids'' right to be well educated.
Brazil, Australia prohibited violent TV games. Even in USA, many movie tape have a Laval for R-rate or X-rated.
If a kid killed another kids, then is the kid the only person to be blamed? Even if the kid is the only person to have "legal" responsibility, the kid may not be the only person to be blamed in the ethical viewpoint.
All kids have the human right to be well educated. That means if our game affects kids badly, or if our game weakens their moral, then we are responsible. We violated kids'' right to be well educated.
Brazil, Australia prohibited violent TV games. Even in USA, many movie tape have a Laval for R-rate or X-rated.
Hello Everyone!
This is my opinion on the subject. People always want what they can''t have. If you are denied something for a certain reason, you''ll begin to want it more and more. That''s the way I think it works with violence. Keeping childeren from violent TV shows, games, and other things will only agrivate the situation. You can''t stop a person forever, and if they do get there hands on it, and arn''t satisfied, they''ll want even more. If this keeps up, the outcome can be devistating.
I say that restricting violence, is what makes the problem worse.
Anyways, on to the real point to this post. What would I do if my game was accused of causing violence. To tell the truth, I don''t know what I would do. I would probably try to give good reasons why it isn''t the cause of violence, and if they felt the need to take me to court, I would do everything I could to defend myself.
Sorry if I mixed up some stuff about court, I''m really not familiar with the US Justice System... Also, I''m just 16..
Anyways, thanks for listening to my opinion. You''ve been a great audience.
-Doddler
This is my opinion on the subject. People always want what they can''t have. If you are denied something for a certain reason, you''ll begin to want it more and more. That''s the way I think it works with violence. Keeping childeren from violent TV shows, games, and other things will only agrivate the situation. You can''t stop a person forever, and if they do get there hands on it, and arn''t satisfied, they''ll want even more. If this keeps up, the outcome can be devistating.
I say that restricting violence, is what makes the problem worse.
Anyways, on to the real point to this post. What would I do if my game was accused of causing violence. To tell the truth, I don''t know what I would do. I would probably try to give good reasons why it isn''t the cause of violence, and if they felt the need to take me to court, I would do everything I could to defend myself.
Sorry if I mixed up some stuff about court, I''m really not familiar with the US Justice System... Also, I''m just 16..
Anyways, thanks for listening to my opinion. You''ve been a great audience.
-Doddler
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